The Dance Hall 11: Movin' On Up 2023-2024

[her grace]

That's sad. I hope that if either wants to continue that they can find new partners. They are both such exciting dancers.

 

[Karen-W]

Olivia Smart was the guest on this week's This Week in Skating podcast and she gave the first public confirmation of the partnership with Tim Dieck. They haven't made the formal announcement yet because they're still figuring out the country logistics/waiting on paperwork/releases.

 

[Sylvia]

Olivia Smart was the guest on this week's This Week in Skating podcast and she gave the first public confirmation of the partnership with Tim Dieck. They haven't made the formal announcement yet because they're still figuring out the country logistics/waiting on paperwork/releases.

Starting after the 54 minute mark:

This Week in Skating Podcast

Listen to This Week in Skating Podcast on RedCircle

redcircle.com

 

[Jeanine]

Surely there's got to be some boy with Irish ancestry in New York or New Jersey to skate with her, lol.

In all seriousness, I'm continually shocked that no-one has gone down that route yet!

 

[skatfan]

Olivia Smart was the guest on this week's This Week in Skating podcast and she gave the first public confirmation of the partnership with Tim Dieck. They haven't made the formal announcement yet because they're still figuring out the country logistics/waiting on paperwork/releases.

It was sad to hear about the abrupt end to her partnership with Adrian. He did not handle it well, so completely unlike his partner in life, Madison Hubbell.

 

[Wyliefan]

Wait, what? I thought he was the one who wanted to end it!

 

[Karen-W]

It was sad to hear about the abrupt end to her partnership with Adrian. He did not handle it well, so completely unlike his partner in life, Madison Hubbell.

Wait, what? I thought he was the one who wanted to end it!

Oh, he did, but it sounds like he kept her completely in the dark about his intentions. Maybe Adrian really didn't know what he wanted to do until after the Olympics or they finished the FS at Worlds, but according to Olivia, he told her he was done a couple hours after they finished competing, so she felt, at the time and in the months afterward, like she had been robbed of the emotional closure she thought she'd have at the end of her competitive career. From her perspective, at least, I think she really thought they'd skate this season and then he essentially pulled the carpet out from under her.

 

[Wyliefan]

Oh, that's too bad. Especially after they had had such a great season.

 

[skatfan]

Wait, what? I thought he was the one who wanted to end it!

As Karen noted, he did end it but at a moment that robbed her of any appreciation for their last time on the ice and taking in all the achievements. My guess is that as Worlds got closer he was more sure about retirement (perhaps the job offer from IAM to relocate to Ontario had come through - which would make it worse because then her coaching team would be a party to things ending), but not 100%.

As things have turned out she’ll be fine. She won Dancing on Ice with her celebrity partner and about to start her new partnership.

 

[Dobre]

Announced today during Bloom on Ice 2023, Japan's junior Kida/Morita have split

Sigh. Japan's junior to senior transition rate seems as disappointing as Italy's.

I do think the Japanese federation could afford to improve the opportunities it offers young athletes in order to aid the process of that transition. It takes a long time to build up an ice dance team if you want those athletes to reach podium level one day. Especially if you aren't going to import athletes from other countries & partner up less experienced athletes with them.

 

[Belsornia]

I'm bummed about Kida/Morita too. I know they didn't have the junior worlds they must have wanted, but their skating had some great qualities and I thought they really had a chance to make a mark in juniors next year.

After a lot of splits among the middle tier of junior, here's an update on the status of the 2022-23 junior field. Between ageing up and splits we could see some new teams breaking through on the JGP.

Junior Worlds:
⦁ Katerina Mrazkova / Daniel Mrazek (CZE) - 1 more season (junior eligible through JWC 2024) but likely moving up
⦁ Hannah Lim / Ye Quan (KOR) - ageing up
⦁ Nadiia Bashynska / Peter Beaumont (CAN) - ageing up
⦁ Phebe Bekker / James Hernandez (GBR) - ageing up
⦁ Leah Neset / Artem Markelov (USA) - 2 more seasons (junior eligible through JWC 2025)
⦁ Celina Fradji / Jean-Hans Fourneaux (FRA) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Sandrine Gauthier / Quentin Thieren (CAN) - ageing up
⦁ Jenna Hauer / Benjamin Starr (USA) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Helena Carhart / Volodymyr Horovyi (USA) - 1 more season
⦁ Angelina Kudryavtseva / Ilia Karankevich (CYP) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Elizabeth Tkachenko / Alexei Kiliakov (ISR) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Mariia Pinchuk / Mykyta Pogorielov (UKR) - 1 more season - but have already done a split season so may move up full time
⦁ Louise Bordet / Thomas Gipoulou (FRA) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Hailey Yu / Brendan Giang (CAN) - split (he's looking for a new partner)
⦁ Karla Maria Karl / Kai Hoferichter (DEU) - ageing up
⦁ Nao Kida / Masaya Morita (JPN) - split (both looking for new partners)
⦁ Noemi Tali / Stefano Frasca (ITA) - split (she's now skating with Noah Lafornara, previously USA)
⦁ Ashlie Slatter / Atl Ongay-Perez (GBR) - 5 more seasons (junior eligible through JWC 2028)
⦁ Grace Vainik / Yehor Barshak (GEO) - split (both looking for new partners)
⦁ Milla O'Brien / Laurin Wiederkehr (SUI) - split (both looking for new partners)
⦁ Xuantong Li / Xinkang Wang (CHN) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Sofiia Dovhal / Wiktor Kulesza (POL) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Anita Straub / Andreas Straub (AUT) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Jinny Kim / Namu Lee (KOR) - 4 more seasons (junior eligible through JWC 2027)
⦁ Athena Roberts / Eric Alis (ESP) - 1 more season
⦁ Irmak Yucel / Nikita Ivanov (TUR) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Maya Benkiewicz / Mark Shapiro (HUN) - 1 more season (if they stay together they'll have to sit out international competition in 2024-25)
⦁ Sofiia Beznosikova / Max Leleu (BEL) - 5 more seasons
⦁ Harlow Stanley / Nikita Sosnenko (MEX) - 2 more seasons

Other teams on the 2022-23 JGP:
⦁ Darya Grimm / Michail Savitskiy (DEU) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Anna Simova / Kirill Aksenov (SVK) - ageing up
⦁ Jordyn Lewis / Noah McMillan (CAN) - 1 more season
⦁ Vanessa Pham / Jonathan Rogers (USA) - split (she's ageing up and looking for a new partner, sounds like he's retiring)
⦁ Iryna Pidgaina / Artem Koval (UKR) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Elliana Peal / Ethan Peal (USA) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Chaima Ben Khelifa / Everest Zhu (CAN) - 1 more season
⦁ Zoe Larson / Andrii Kapran (UKR) - ageing up
⦁ Romy Malcolm / Noah Lafornara (USA) - split (he's now skating with Noemi Tali for ITA, she's looking for a new partner)
⦁ Marianne Hubert / William Oddson (CAN) - split (both looking for new partners)
⦁ Kristina Bland / Matthew Sperry (USA) - 1 more season
⦁ Dana Sabatini-Speciale / Nicholas Buelow (CAN) - 2 more seaons
⦁ Natalie Blaasova / Filip Blaas (CZE) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Layla Veillon / Alexander Brandys (CAN) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Lou Koch / Ivan Melnyk (FRA) - split (she's looking for a new partner)
⦁ Giorgia Galimberti / Matteo Libasse Madelli (ITA) - ageing up
⦁ Laura Finelli / Matteo Stefano Pedesini (ITA) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Lila-Maya Seclet-Monchot / Martin Chardain (FRA) - ageing up
⦁ Alexia Kruk / Jan Eisenhaber (DEU) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Mia Lee Mayer / Tobia Huber (DEU) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Alice Pizzorni / Massimiliano Bucciarelli (ITA) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Jillian Prever / Agahan Dortkol (TUR) - 1 more season
⦁ Ambre Perrier Gianesini / Samuel Blanc Klaperman (FRA) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Xinyi Yu / Tianyi Liu (CHN) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Yufei Lin / Zijian Gao (CHN) - 1 more season
⦁ Catharina Guedes Tibau / Cayden Dawson (BRA) - 3 more seasons
⦁ Andrea Psurna / Jachym Novak (CZE) - 4 more seasons
⦁ Daniela Ivanitskiy / David Goldshteyn (FIN) - split (she's ageing up and looking for a new partner)
⦁ Eloanne Ogor / Raul Bermejo (ESP) - split (he's ageing up and looking for a new partner)
⦁ Sophia Bushell / Alex Lapsky (GBR) - split (both looking for new partners)
⦁ Hilda Taylor / Urho Reina (FIN) - 2 more seasons
⦁ Isabella Sukhovskaya / Trevor Sebastian Malkasaari (EST) - split (she's looking for a new partner)
⦁ Laura Hegarty / Kevin Hegarty (IRE) - 1 more season
⦁ Chi Linh Nguyen / Minh Quang Nguyen (VIE) - 3 more seasons

 

[kwanfan1818]

I thought both Hubbell and Diaz expected to be done after last season to get on with their lives. I know there was some hope among fans that Hubbell and squire would stay in a year without P/C, so that they could get a deserved world title, but I never felt that Hubbell ever equivocated, and, granted, I wasn't paying close attention, but I don't remember him waffling.

 

[RoseRed]

I thought both Hubbell and Diaz expected to be done after last season to get on with their lives. I know there was some hope among fans that Hubbell and squire would stay in a year without P/C, so that they could get a deserved world title, but I never felt that Hubbell ever equivocated, and, granted, I wasn't paying close attention, but I don't remember him waffling.

I don't remember him saying much publicly, but I definitely had the impression that they might continue. In this interview with TSL from January 2022, Olivia said that they'd agreed to make the decision after Worlds and that at the time: "It's not a no, and it's not a yes". She also said "After Europeans in Graz (in 2021), Adrian mentioned to me about going another season after the Olympics", and that she was very happy about the idea. She was clear in the interview that it wasn't a promise / wasn't definite, but it was on the table as an option. And she said that they talked about it the summer before the Olympics and she asked if continuing was still on the table, and they both agreed to wait to make the decision. So I don't think he was fully decided on retiring in the same way Madi was.

 

[kwanfan1818]

If I were a team that wasn't at the very top, and maybe even then, I certainly wouldn't be announcing publicly that this season was it, because that gives judges a reason to dismiss a team, or at least weigh perceived error and weaknesses more severely. I'd be on the "we haven't decided" train.

There have been cases where skaters have described deciding to keep options open for a while about returning, because one was in and the other wasn't at the moment, and then in the next moment, that flipped, but each continued to agree to not make a final decision or announcement. That clearly wasn't the case here, because he was no longer discussing anything. But we've seen some pretty devastating situations where one skater wasn't really in, but continued, at least up to a point.

I don't think she would have been happy whenever he told her, but whether he knew it was over earlier, with or without a job offer at IAM, and didn't tell her, or it he knew in the moment that that was his last performance, his timing was awful ie, he could have given her a day to wake up celebrating. (eta: having learned this from @RoseRed's post)

The best case scenario is where partners decide to split/retire mutually, as Mimi would put it in La.Boheme, senza rancor, but easier said than done, because Mimi doesn't even take her own advice, hence the need for Act IV.

 

[VGThuy]

Another illustration of how business partnerships can be really tough and emotionally-taxing.

 

[sap5]

I don't think she would have been happy whenever he told her, but whether he knew it was over earlier, with or without a job offer at IAM, and didn't tell her, or it he knew in the moment that that was his last performance, his timing was awful ie, he could have given her a day to wake up celebrating. (eta: having learned this from @RoseRed's post)

The best case scenario is where partners decide to split/retire mutually, as Mimi would put it in La.Boheme, senza rancor, but easier said than done, because Mimi doesn't even take her own advice, hence the need for Act IV.

I think this is just hard to say. Maybe he genuinely thought the timing wasn't awful? Maybe he was finally sure of his decision right after the FD, and thought to tell her right away because she had been asking for so long and he wasn't sure of the answer until that moment?

Obviously Olivia has the right to feel the way she wants to feel. But I'm not a fan of blaming someone else for making you feel the way you feel. It doesn't seem like it was Adrian's intention to treat her badly. She says she was blindsided, but at the same time, she says she assumed he wasn't retiring when he never said that.

 

[kwanfan1818]

It reminds me of the scene in The Turning Point where the Lucia Chase character tells Emma at the end-of-season gala dinner that she'll be coaching Aurora in the next season, and while he understands it's true that she's not right for the role anymore, James Mitchell's character tells the Lucia Chase character (emphatically) that her timing is terrible. Because it was.

 

[Karen-W]

From the French news thread... PapCiz confirm they will NOT be competing next season.

Are you thinking about coming back to competitions and defining new goals?
Gabriella: We are thinking about it. It is a discussion we've had with us and our federation. We are starting to look at our future projects. But it's just a discussion.

With the 2026 OG in sight?
Guillaume: Not yet, we don't know yet. I think we will take more time to think about it. We will take next season off to do shows and refine our projects.

The pause could last longer than expected?
Gabriella: We'll see (laughing!!)

Pas de reprise de la compétition en vue pour les Clermontois Gabriella Papadakis et Guillaume Cizeron - France Bleu

Les patineurs artistiques Gabriella Papadakis et Guillaume Cizeron étaient de retour chez eux, à Clermont-Ferrand, pour un gala avec l'équipe de France ce samedi 23 avril. Ils n'ont toujours pas pris de décision pour un éventuel retour à la compétition.

www.francebleu.fr

So no Papdakis-Cizeron in 2023/24!! But they are not closing the door for a come-back.

 

[chantilly]

I’d say if they don’t come back for 24/25 season they’re done for good.

 

[Karen-W]

I’d say if they don’t come back for 24/25 season they’re done for good.

I don't really expect that they will be back at all.

 

[skatfan]

From the French news thread... PapCiz confirm they will NOT be competing next season.

Not a surprise. I kinda doubt they will return at all - but I do hope they will still skate and choreograph

 

[Gris]

A Korean article about Lim and Quan:

뉴스 : 네이버스포츠

n.news.naver.com

Excerpt about next season's RD (Google translate):

I asked Lim Hae-na for hints about the program for the next season. He said, “The ice dance rhythm dance theme for the senior stage next season is ‘1980s music’. Looking at other teams training in Canada, it seems that they already choose a lot of Michael Jackson's music. Our coach recommended that Prince's song would suit him, but he will probably prepare a very fancy costume," he said with a broad smile.

So lots of MJ programs coming? Can't say I'm excited for that...

 

[Belsornia]

Looks like Lafond-Fournier / Kam have split.

From two NZ teams to zero in a matter of weeks.

 

[Wyliefan]

So lots of MJ programs coming? Can't say I'm excited for that...

Called it. https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/threads/2023-2024-rhythm-dance.110442/page-12#post-6417103

 

[Wyliefan]

All these hopes and dreams, and we're probably going to end up with half Madonna and half Michael Jackson.

(Couldn't put that quote in the previous post, so I'm putting it here.)

 

[marbri]

A Korean article about Lim and Quan:

뉴스 : 네이버스포츠

n.news.naver.com

Excerpt about next season's RD (Google translate):



So lots of MJ programs coming? Can't say I'm excited for that...

My god, that makes it sound like multiple IAM teams are using MJ music

For the love of god skaters, find someone in their 50´s to find some decent 80's music for you.

 

[Former Lurve Goddess]

My god, that makes it sound like multiple IAM teams are using MJ music

For the love of god skaters, find someone in their 50´s to find some decent 80's music for you.

This GenXer is willing to make a special trip to IAM to help them out on the 80s music front

 

[flatfoot]

Olivia Smart was the guest on this week's This Week in Skating podcast and she gave the first public confirmation of the partnership with Tim Dieck. They haven't made the formal announcement yet because they're still figuring out the country logistics/waiting on paperwork/releases.

She also spoke about it on the recent tsl interview and Tim seems excited to let everyone know so I think we will know soon

If I was a betting man my money would be on them skating for Spain. I remember hearing an interview with Olivia when she said that the reason herself and Adria chose Spain was because it was easier to get a Spanish passport than a British passport. Again the team are living and training in Montreal and Tim is not British so the same will probably apply. In relation to skating for Germany, haven't they also got some kind of residency and citizenship test clause. I am basing this on the what I read about Aljona and Bruno training in Germany and Bruno taking a language/citizenship test. So as Olivia is not German and is not resident there I'm not sure that is an option. I think Spain is the only one of the three that will give a passport to a foreign athlete purely on exceptional sporting talent with no residency or heritage links. However I am no immigration expert so could be entirely wrong.
Also, Olivia said how bad she felt for the Spanish federation that they worked so hard to get two spots and then both teams retired so perhaps with that loyalty to Spain she will remain with them.
Or perhaps they will surprise everyone and skate for a different country entirely. I guess we will just have to wait.

 

[Rhumba d’Amour]

I’m wondering whether Canada would be a possibility. Gilles/Poirier and F-B/S can’t skate forever and yes, there are some young teams coming up, but that could be a hospitable place for a British passport holder who has lived and trained there for years—and from what we are hearing, Germany is not overly invested in/supportive of, its skaters’ careers at present.

If Skate Canada were to step up to the plate, it could acquire a potentially strong, interesting team with plenty of eligible years ahead of it.

 

[Trillian]

I’m wondering whether Canada would be a possibility.

In theory it would probably be a solid option for Olivia with the right partner, but I don’t think Tim Dieck is that guy. He hasn’t spent any significant time in Canada prior to last year, has he? I’m not sure CAN citizenship for 2026 would even be a possibility. I would expect that alone to be a major consideration. Beyond that, even if the top two teams both retire, CAN still has considerable depth at the national level.

Spain seems like the most logical option because it has the least arduous path to citizenship (GBR and GER do both have citizenship requirements that could be challenging AFAIK), and they wouldn’t have a ton of domestic competition at this point. But who knows what other factors are involved.