Maria Butyrskaya - Ilia Malinin is not even American

[tony]

Malinin clearly speaks Russian with his parents- we’ve seen fluff pieces where Malinina is instructing him in Russian, and I’m pretty sure people have also commented on he and Roman speaking Russian in the kiss and cry.

But who really cares through all of this? Ilia stands on top of the podium with a USA flag and his parents put him up through the USFS skating system after having moved to Virginia and coached themselves, resulting from the sudden death of their shared coach.

 

[Mell]

These boys do feel like part of Russia. If anybody interested, Andrew, Maxim and Ilia giving an interview in Russian back in the junior years.

РоÑÑÐ¸Ñ vs СШР- ÑемÑÑ, конкÑÑенÑиÑ, ÑзÑк, денÑги. ÐÑвеÑаÑÑ Ð°Ð¼ÐµÑиканÑкие ÑигÑÑиÑÑÑ Ñ ÑÑÑÑкими коÑнÑми

Мужская сборная США на чемпионате мира среди юниоров – 2020 оказалось уникальной. Все три фигуриста в американской заявке – немного русские. Их родители выст...

youtu.be

 

[On My Own]

I personally don't see any value in the word "American".

I can see why your opinion matters a lot.

 

[airgelaal]

Isn't it like that? It's a country of immigrants. Nobody is "native", everybody comes from other cultures around the world. I personally don't see any value in the word "American". It's not even an ethnicity. My cousin lives and works there, has a wife and child from there. But he is not "american". I see the US as a place for people from other cultures who needs a place to stay. shrug

And russia is a country that has russified other ethnic groups for centuries. For centuries, it forced people to officially become “russian” because other ethnic groups were not given a chance to develop.
People who know the history of russia understand perfectly the value of this “russian”
I won’t be surprised that these boys are not ethnically russian at all. It’s just that their ancestors named themselves that way in their passports.

 

[Rukia]

In the end the only person who's thoughts on this really matter is Ilia himself lol

but also it's entirely possible for him to feel some connection to Russia and also cry with bald eagles because freedom or whatever

 

[bardtoob]

Malinin clearly speaks Russian with his parents- we’ve seen fluff pieces where Malinina is instructing him in Russian, and I’m pretty sure people have also commented on he and Roman speaking Russian in the kiss and cry.

But who really cares through all of this? Ilia stands on top of the podium with a USA flag and his parents put him up through the USFS skating system after having moved to Virginia and coached themselves, resulting from the sudden death of their shared coach.

This does not reflect on your point, but I don't see how anybody can conclude that speaking Russian with your parents, even if they coach you, is some how being a product of the Russian system. In fact, it is very human as well as very American for parents to be the primary teacher in one's mother tongue. Certainly, Maribel Vinson Owen had multiple daughters that she coached to be champions after being a champion herself. Furthermore, Ilia's skating is supported by non-government funded American skating infrastructure on the market that is accredited by the non-government organization, US Figure Skating.

Ilia does not receive group lessons at a government funded central sports club by a non-relative coach that services as a surrogate parent and gets 1/3 of the skater's earnings.

 

[tony]

This does not reflect on your point, but I don't see how anybody can conclude that speaking Russian with your parents, even if they coach you, is some how being a product of the Russian system.

The point I was making was that he indeed does seem to speak a fair amount of Russian 'at home', as had been somewhat debated in earlier posts. But then, quoting myself:

But who really cares through all of this? Ilia stands on top of the podium with a USA flag and his parents put him up through the USFS skating system after having moved to Virginia and coached themselves, resulting from the sudden death of their shared coach.

At the end of the day, he's winning medals for the United States. He's not winning medals for Russia or even Uzebekistan under the guise of a different flag, and he didn't 'switch countries' because of lack of opportunity before or after the war with Ukraine. Malinina and Skorniakov have lived here for almost 25 years now, and I'm really thrilled that they have a superstar child.

 

[bardtoob]

The point I was making was that he indeed does seem to speak a fair amount of Russian 'at home', as had been somewhat debated in earlier posts. But then, quoting myself:

At the end of the day, he's winning medals for the United States. He's not winning medals for Russia or even Uzebekistan under the guise of a different flag, and he didn't 'switch countries' because of lack of opportunity before or after the war with Ukraine.

So, we were basically making the same point.

 

[Lynn226]

I think one point that MB is missing is that TM has been in the United States a long time. I'm sure the Russian influence is still there, but she has likely been influenced by the American system her son competes in, other coaches of many nationalities, and whatever professional development opportunities she has pursued. Ilia is a child of an immigrant and that influences him, along with American culture and figure skating culture.

I guess I'm trying to say nobody is an island without multiple influences on their life.

 

[Simone411]

All I know is this. Since Ilia was born in December of 2004 in Fairfax, Virginia, it makes him a U.S. citizen. He is an American Figure Skater that represents the U.S.

Ilia Malinin - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Cachoo]

Isn't it like that? It's a country of immigrants. Nobody is "native", everybody comes from other cultures around the world. I personally don't see any value in the word "American". It's not even an ethnicity. My cousin lives and works there, has a wife and child from there. But he is not "american". I see the US as a place for people from other cultures who needs a place to stay. shrug

So you don’t think at any point we become American?

 

[Sparks]

All I know is this. Since Ilia was born in December of 2004 in Fairfax, Virginia, it makes him a U.S. citizen. He is an American Figure Skater that represents the U.S.

Ilia Malinin - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Point blank and the period

 

[Rukia]

So you don’t think at any point we become American?

You have to be wrapped in a US flag and baptized by the tears of Uncle Sam first

 

[Cachoo]

You have to be wrapped in a US flag and baptized by the tears of Uncle Sam first

Does that involve political ideology?

 

[Simone411]

So you don’t think at any point we become American?

Here's everything you need to know including the Naturalization requirements.

Apply for Citizenship

As a lawful permanent resident, you may be eligible to become a U.S. citizen through naturalization. Check your eligibility for naturalization.

www.uscis.gov

 

[nlloyd]

Isn't it like that? It's a country of immigrants. Nobody is "native", everybody comes from other cultures around the world. I personally don't see any value in the word "American". It's not even an ethnicity. My cousin lives and works there, has a wife and child from there. But he is not "american". I see the US as a place for people from other cultures who needs a place to stay. shrug

Are you saying that Native Americans are not native to the U.S.? That seems a strange argument to make.

Also, there are very few countries where the name of the country is synonymous with an ethnicity. Most countries are comprised of multiple ethnicities.

 

[Cachoo]

Here's everything you need to know including the Naturalization requirements.

Apply for Citizenship

As a lawful permanent resident, you may be eligible to become a U.S. citizen through naturalization. Check your eligibility for naturalization.

www.uscis.gov

Looking at that I have so much admiration for the folks that take the plunge and come here. There is so much to learn, so much adjusting. But I was more curious about the idea of being American. I live on a cul-de-sac that is me, next to a black family, next to immigrants from Mexico, next to an elderly white woman, next to a Muslim family who immigrated from Morroco decades ago, next to a black and white family, next to a white couple and finally a young black family. We are racially and religiously diverse but I see us as American. It isn’t something I think about— it simply is….we simply are.

 

[Vagabond]

Are you saying that Native Americans are not native to the U.S.? That seems a strange argument to make.

Native Americans came to the Americas across the Bering Land Bridge from Russia and are thus Russians. Everyone knows this.

​

 

[Wyliefan]

All roads lead to Russia!

 

[DreamSkates]

Butyrskaya and Malinina were super close friends back in the day and I’d imagine they still are. I remember she once said that after they both failed to qualify for the short at 1993 Worlds, they sat and cried together. I also still remember Tatiana being super supportive to Maria at 2000 NHK directly after the marks came up that gave Slutskaya the controversial win.

Maria is and probably will always be my absolute favorite skater. I maintained her official website two decades(!) ago and have been so happy to see her in photos and videos having fun with Irina in the last few years after that rivalry was built up. But she should’ve just skipped the quote here.

Not ever my favorite although I did respect he accomplishments, but, born in a country makes you a citizen of same. Many people born in this country have parents or grandparents from other countries. My Grandparents on both sides

 

[airgelaal]

By the way, it is very popular among russians to have children in the USA. For example, Ilinykh gave birth to her first child here. And she is not the only one. It doesn’t matter how russian they all are, but for some reason they don’t really like the russian passport only for their children

 

[Theatregirl1122]

Not ever my favorite although I did respect he accomplishments, but, born in a country makes you a citizen of same. Many people born in this country have parents or grandparents from other countries. My Grandparents on both sides

Being born in the US makes you a citizen of the US. Birthright citizenship is uncommon in much of the world (much more common in the Americas). So it’s not a blanket fact that being born in a country makes you a citizen of the country.

 

[Simone411]

My grandfather came from Syria to the U.S. in the early 1900's. He married my grandmother who was of English decent and a citizen of the U.S. somewhere around 1915. They had six children, one being my father. Since they were born in the U.S., all of their birth certificates show that (the city and the state they were born in). Since they were citizens, they also received Social Security cards/ID's.

My grandfather got his citizenship papers in 1952, died a year later and I never had the privilege of knowing him because I was born five years later.

Since Ilia was born in the U.S., his birth certificate shows that. He was also issued a social security card/ID just like anyone else born in the U.S.

 

[bardtoob]

I see the US as a place for people from other cultures who needs a place to stay. shrug

The New Colossus - Statue Of Liberty National Monument (U.S. National Park Service)

www.nps.gov

The New Colossus

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles.

From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Emma Lazarus
November 2, 1883

 

[Private Citizen]

So you don’t think at any point we become American?

From a practical standpoint, most people who hold this opinion will view the third generation as (more or less) fully American, and definitely the fourth.

I've seen it described with Italians as:

• immigrants (gen 1): Italians (even if they naturalize)
• children of immigrants (gen 2): Italian-American
• grandchildren of immigrants (gen 3): American-Italian
• great-grandchildren of immigrants (gen 4): Americans

From a European legal standpoint, children of immigrants are virtually always entitled to the citizenship of their parents' country; in most cases, it's the only citizenship they get. Grandchildren are sometimes entitled to citizenship, with conditions. Great-grandchildren are almost never, with some exceptions (Italy being the most notable one, with conditions).

So I'm not surprised that Europeans view Malinin (or his sister) as Russian and not totally American. I would be surprised, however, if Europeans viewed Malinin's or his sister's potential future children as Russian. And all claim to Russia definitely expires with Ilia's and his sister's future grandchildren.

 

[parmazhannagromova]

Maria has often been taken out of context and painted a bitch in skating... this is more par for the course. She is thrilled for Malinin and highlighting his Russian heritage. And it is clear her friendship with Tatiana is so dear to her and that's heartwarming.

It's not uncommon for 'diaspora' athletes or celebrities, or their descendants to be celebrated in their ancestral countries - and she's providing another reason why Ilia should be recognised for his achievements in rebuke of Irina's comments.

 

[airgelaal]

Maria’s main message is that it just so happened that the russian Ilia was born and raised in the USA. That is why he represents the United States. But this is not so. No one could force Ilia to compete for the United States; his parents could choose russia. As, for example, Makarova’s parents did. USA was a conscious choice and that is why he is an American skater, not a russian.

 

[Simone411]

Maria’s main message is that it just so happened that the russian Ilia was born and raised in the USA. That is why he represents the United States. But this is not so. No one could force Ilia to compete for the United States; his parents could choose russia. As, for example, Makarova’s parents did. USA was a conscious choice and that is why he is an American skater, not a russian.

This is true while Ilia was younger. His parents could have decided to go back to Russia, but they chose to stay here. Even if they would have taken him back to Russia, he would have still been a U.S. citizen since he was born in the U.S.A.

Now that he's age 19, he can choose whatever he wishes to do even if his parents went back to Russia. Ilia can vote in elections in the U.S., volunteer for the U.S. military. The only one thing he cannot do is buy liquor in the U.S. because you have to be 21. When he turned 13, he would have had the right to stay here if he wished as long as he had a relative living in the U.S.

My brother and his wife were divorced. His ex-wife had custody of his daughter (my niece). When she turned 13, she decided she wanted to live with her dad. His ex-wife's lawyer told her that she couldn't fight that in court because she would lose since she had turned 13 years old. She lived with her dad after that.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

Maria is a prime example of what 50 years of constant peroxide abuse has done to her mind.

 

[olympic]

@Mell - your words seem coded and don't track very well with the thread. You got some serious pro-Russia psy-ops working here